SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Wiimeiser » Sun Sep 20, 2020 6:00 am

Enjl wrote:
Sun Sep 20, 2020 5:36 am
Wiimeiser wrote:
Sat Sep 19, 2020 7:18 am
That actually begs the question: Can custom lua flags be saved to be run on loading a level?
Do you mean like the beta 4 config like npc extra settings, darkness and beat timer?
I mean like triggering an event in one level that can significantly and permanently alter a completely different level. Actually, Super Mario Land 3: Wario Land does this quite a bit.

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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Enjl » Sun Sep 20, 2020 7:14 am

You can use SaveData for that.
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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby candle » Tue Sep 22, 2020 12:02 pm

Despite the guides on how to use the level editor, I still find it difficult to familiarize myself with the matter. And then I was thinking... How about a community project to make an episode about how to make an episode? An episode that you continuously "playtest" in the editor edit: as you learn how to create levels and world maps? /edit

So, I'm thinking about a single "world" that represents the campus and the surroundings of something like The Royal Academia of Designers (working title). There could be a level for the main building where the courses take place, and several other levels for different sites of interest (a cafeteria, a gym...). Experienced level designers could submit their own classroom(s), which the maintainers of this episode could then integrate into the existing main building or other areas (levels) on the campus. And like in real academies (?), several designers could offer courses on the same subject, so that students could choose whose emphasis and teaching methods they like best. Or several designers could decide to arrange among themselves how to teach a certain subject, maybe even give a class together.

As to the classrooms, I know teaching will be difficult for as long as you can't edit levels while you playtest them (I hear this will be possible again in the future?). Maybe tutors could make heavy use of screenshots, to be displayed on magic boards. And maybe tutors could prepare their classrooms so students can examine and then edit or reconstruct them according to the instructions they were given, and immediately see whether everything worked out correctly. Again, I'm aware that having to close the playtesting window, then edit the episode, then having to return to the correct classroom is going to be awkward. Maybe every classroom could be given their own warp point to make this more feasible. (Also useful in case tutors employ dangerous teaching methods...) But even with less interactivity, I think learning would be easier this way than through reading guides alone.

I realize I'm getting carried away, and I hope all those ideas clarify rather than obscure what I'm trying to suggest. One more little detail: If there should be such an episode after all, I would like it to start at some train station, where players may either take a warp pipe directly to their destination or take part in a train ride to it, where players could chat with their future fellow students and future tutors.

Me, I can hardly create a barebone level, so I'd be glad if someone else takes up this idea, maybe even making it one of the default episodes of SMBX.
Last edited by candle on Tue Sep 22, 2020 1:20 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Enjl » Tue Sep 22, 2020 12:21 pm

usually, episodes as a whole aren't tested until the general structure and most levels are finished. and then they're tested through the regular game, instead of the editor. until then, levels themselves are tested and refined.
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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby candle » Tue Sep 22, 2020 12:51 pm

I mean, the permanent "playtesting" is part of the concept: It allows you to immediately jump to the desired classroom (if there's a warp point in each classroom), and once the editor allows on-the-fly editing again, players could apply more easily what they've just learned.

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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Enjl » Tue Sep 22, 2020 12:56 pm

on fifth re-read i think i understood what you were trying to convey. i think you're describing skillshare.
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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby candle » Tue Sep 22, 2020 1:05 pm

I'm not familiar with the like-named platform, but I think skillsharing is what I mean, yes. Like I said, I got carried away and tried to add all sorts of suggestions to the initial idea... So, it's supposed to be a tutorial episode in which players learn how to use the editor. Experienced designers could contribute lessons to it. And to make navigation easier, it could be "playtested" with the corresponding editor feature (so players can directly select the warp point that leads to a particular lesson). In later releases of the editor, using the playtesting feature would additionally allow players to edit the episode on the fly, thus allowing for fully interactive lessons.

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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Enjl » Tue Sep 22, 2020 1:32 pm

none of the skills related to episode completion (knowledge of own limits, project management, balancing...) are things that lend themselves well to be learnt by placing random objects in the editor in prefabricated "lessons". personal experiences and failure are the best tutors.
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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Amyrakunejo » Tue Sep 22, 2020 10:07 pm

What that 'tutorial' sounds like to me is the one offered with WolfRPG Editor.
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What my POTATO PC can run with little to no issues:
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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Jumper » Wed Sep 23, 2020 4:22 am

Amyrakunejo wrote:
Tue Sep 22, 2020 10:07 pm
What that 'tutorial' sounds like to me is the one offered with WolfRPG Editor.
Interestingly enough, I know exactly what you're talking about, as I've dipped my toes into various different Game Making tools (WolfRPG being an example), but let's get back on topic.
candle wrote:
Tue Sep 22, 2020 12:02 pm
Spoiler: show
Despite the guides on how to use the level editor, I still find it difficult to familiarize myself with the matter. And then I was thinking... How about a community project to make an episode about how to make an episode? An episode that you continuously "playtest" in the editor edit: as you learn how to create levels and world maps? /edit

So, I'm thinking about a single "world" that represents the campus and the surroundings of something like The Royal Academia of Designers (working title). There could be a level for the main building where the courses take place, and several other levels for different sites of interest (a cafeteria, a gym...). Experienced level designers could submit their own classroom(s), which the maintainers of this episode could then integrate into the existing main building or other areas (levels) on the campus. And like in real academies (?), several designers could offer courses on the same subject, so that students could choose whose emphasis and teaching methods they like best. Or several designers could decide to arrange among themselves how to teach a certain subject, maybe even give a class together.

As to the classrooms, I know teaching will be difficult for as long as you can't edit levels while you playtest them (I hear this will be possible again in the future?). Maybe tutors could make heavy use of screenshots, to be displayed on magic boards. And maybe tutors could prepare their classrooms so students can examine and then edit or reconstruct them according to the instructions they were given, and immediately see whether everything worked out correctly. Again, I'm aware that having to close the playtesting window, then edit the episode, then having to return to the correct classroom is going to be awkward. Maybe every classroom could be given their own warp point to make this more feasible. (Also useful in case tutors employ dangerous teaching methods...) But even with less interactivity, I think learning would be easier this way than through reading guides alone.

I realize I'm getting carried away, and I hope all those ideas clarify rather than obscure what I'm trying to suggest. One more little detail: If there should be such an episode after all, I would like it to start at some train station, where players may either take a warp pipe directly to their destination or take part in a train ride to it, where players could chat with their future fellow students and future tutors.

Me, I can hardly create a barebone level, so I'd be glad if someone else takes up this idea, maybe even making it one of the default episodes of SMBX.
As I've read this comment, I agree that something like this should be in SMBX, although I can see it being difficult to implement, and it's probably not worth the trouble just for a Tutorial.

Regardless, a Tutorial Episode is not a bad idea, and is definitely helpful to newbie level/episode developers, and possibly veterans as well.

In fact, I've whipped up a mock-up as to what it could look like:
Spoiler: show
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thehelmetguy1 wrote: True rules of SMBX:
1-SMB3 graphics ftw
2-SMB3 graphics are the answer to life
3-If you don't use SMB3 graphics you don't know how to make levels
4-SMB3 graphics are the most important thing to have in your level
5-SMB3 graphics were so loved that someone said they were overrated and this person died 1337 times and became a SMB3 graphic. We could make a religion out of this.

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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby SergioZen25 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 7:02 am

I don't know how many of these have been said before or if they are planned at all, but I have a few suggestions or things I would like to see in future updates:

1-More power-ups: like the Frog suit, P-Baloon, etc. I know there are some like the propeller suit that have an item which works sorta like it, so those ones I would say are not that important, although could have use still and more variety means more posibilities and posible level designs.

2-Autotiles: I find the editor a bit slow to create some stuff, maybe if we had some special tiles that worked like ground in SMM we could speed up the workflow of creating levels.

3-Episode options: With this I'm refering to changing stuff that directly affects the episode itself, like having timers, changing the hitpoints system, etc. I know there are lua scritps for that, but it would be nice to have it implemented like a simple button to activate or deactivate, just like we have the characters selection.

4-SMB1 Flagpole: I feel like this is the only ending that is lacking in the game, we could even have a smaller pole to act as the secret exits like in the NSMB series.

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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Enjl » Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:08 am

SergioZen25 wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 7:02 am
2-Autotiles: I find the editor a bit slow to create some stuff, maybe if we had some special tiles that worked like ground in SMM we could speed up the workflow of creating levels.
This is less about specific tiles being special, and more about the editor lacking a tool.
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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Chilly14 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 5:18 pm

Umm...the Rocky Wrench isn't working properly.
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Its wrenches are supposed to move upwards, but now they stopped doing that.
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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Amyrakunejo » Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:44 pm

Enjl wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:08 am
SergioZen25 wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 7:02 am
2-Autotiles: I find the editor a bit slow to create some stuff, maybe if we had some special tiles that worked like ground in SMM we could speed up the workflow of creating levels.
This is less about specific tiles being special, and more about the editor lacking a tool.
Also, sizable blocks are a thing.
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And at night she whispers, Ride the Wind, never comin' back 'til I touch the midnight sun...


"Is there really a choice for us, or are we always, sometimes monsters?"

What my POTATO PC can run with little to no issues:
SMBX 1.3, SMBX 2 Beta 3, RM2000/2003/XP/VX/VX Ace
What it struggles with:
NSMBX, SMBX 2 Beta 4, RMMV


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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Teemster2 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 12:18 am

candle wrote:
Tue Sep 22, 2020 12:51 pm
I mean, the permanent "playtesting" is part of the concept: It allows you to immediately jump to the desired classroom (if there's a warp point in each classroom), and once the editor allows on-the-fly editing again, players could apply more easily what they've just learned.
There is tutorials on YouTube that may help you as well as guides here and online. Practice makes perfect.
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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby FireyPaperMario » Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:44 pm

SergioZen25 wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 7:02 am
I think you're asking a little too much for the 2.0.0 Devs. And you know that Paint.net and other pixel-art making software can be used to edit stuff.... Right?
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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby SergioZen25 » Sat Sep 26, 2020 4:59 am

FireyPaperMario wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:44 pm
SergioZen25 wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 7:02 am
I think you're asking a little too much for the 2.0.0 Devs. And you know that Paint.net and other pixel-art making software can be used to edit stuff.... Right?
I'm not asking for them, they are just suggestions, ideas that I think would make the editor/game a bit better. And yeah, I use Paint.net a lot, but having to edit a lot of tiles individually can be tiresome.

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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Jumper » Sat Sep 26, 2020 7:40 am

SergioZen25 wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 4:59 am
FireyPaperMario wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:44 pm
SergioZen25 wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 7:02 am
I think you're asking a little too much for the 2.0.0 Devs. And you know that Paint.net and other pixel-art making software can be used to edit stuff.... Right?
I'm not asking for them, they are just suggestions, ideas that I think would make the editor/game a bit better. And yeah, I use Paint.net a lot, but having to edit a lot of tiles individually can be tiresome.
I'll be honest: as fun as it is making custom content for SMBX goes, having to edit tiles separately does get repetitive and tiresome after a while, but fortunately there are options.
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thehelmetguy1 wrote: True rules of SMBX:
1-SMB3 graphics ftw
2-SMB3 graphics are the answer to life
3-If you don't use SMB3 graphics you don't know how to make levels
4-SMB3 graphics are the most important thing to have in your level
5-SMB3 graphics were so loved that someone said they were overrated and this person died 1337 times and became a SMB3 graphic. We could make a religion out of this.

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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby candle » Sat Sep 26, 2020 12:56 pm

About my suggestion for a tutorial episode about the editor: Yes, I envisioned those classrooms pretty much like Jumper has illustrated it. Well, I was rather thinking about the issues that are not so self-explanatory (How to build a tank? How to build an airship? How to let the music fade out, how to let another one start when a certain point in a dialogue is reached?), but I think lessons about the basics would be helpful, too. Personally I'd prefer to learn all this from a (interactive) tutorial episode rather than having to search the info on various platforms. Also, I think community projects are always good for the team spirit of a community and that this may be a good occasion to start another one.

I don't want to anticipate the result of the discussion, but if the community decides to not make it a community project, I'd be happy if someone else takes up the idea. I haven't played SMBX for months, so I don't think I'd design such an episode myself, or even review and organise contributed lessons from other designers.

(OT: Why I haven't revisited SMBX for such a long time? Because I'm still mentally recovering from my attempt to play all MaGLX 2 levels without cheat codes, exploits or even the officially allowed cheat-items :shock: )

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Re: SMBX2 BETA 4 Release - Feedback and Suggestions here!

Postby Enjl » Sat Sep 26, 2020 1:30 pm

you can make your airships however you want
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