[Poll] General Political Thread.

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Who would be a good president?

Mario
4
33%
Luigi
5
42%
Fat Albert
3
25%
 
Total votes: 12
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election

Postby Aero » Thu Jul 14, 2016 3:57 am

Left wing terrorism has been a thing as long as there has been a left wing. The fact that you think there's less violence the further left you go just shows you have no understanding of some of the worst events in modern history, and haven't bothered to look up groups that fit the description. It's not your fault they don't teach history in schools anymore, but that doesn't excuse not taking five minutes to look up left wing terrorism and how prevalent it is.

Also the minimum wage is a terrible, depression era idea that hurts people instead of helping. I'd say passing a remedial economics exam should be a requirement to be able to vote, but it would disenfranchise almost the entire country and certainly the entire Democratic party.
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election

Postby mechamind » Thu Jul 14, 2016 4:58 am

I generally can't just judge their "average" nowadays. Like it or not, a politician can be to the left in some areas and to the right on others. The mix of ideology does apply to the past as well.

Just let them die and save the extra buck, regardless of which side they're on. Keep thinking to yourself, but the ideal of violence and genocide is right-wing, even if it is called for by a member of a party that is normally associated with the left.

Now in a less extreme example, I could never call Obama a leftist for his support of copyright legislation, but I could for his introduction of "Obamacare". Additionally, Trump's opposition to NAFTA is also argued as a leftist view, not necessarily when he says it; but NAFTA support is and has been associated with the right.
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election

Postby onpon4 » Thu Jul 14, 2016 7:12 am

AeroMatter wrote:These distinctions exist for a reason. Sure, they're not monolithic groups, but they describe attitudes and labels make it so there's a jumping off point for a conversation to happen.
More like a jumping off point for identity politics. We already have it here: you guys are arguing about whether terrorism is more in the "left" or more in the "right", but you're being incredibly vague, both of you. And this kind of "discussion" is nothing but divisive, pointlessly so. Arguments should be about actual positions and policy, not identities.

The main reason I dislike "left" vs "right" politics is I see it all the time where possibly valid arguments are just completely disregarded because it's "left-wing" or "right-wing", because the person doing this identifies as the opposite.

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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election

Postby Aero » Thu Jul 14, 2016 11:35 am

mechamind wrote:
Words have meanings. Use them right or don't use them.
onpon4 wrote:More like a jumping off point for identity politics. We already have it here: you guys are arguing about whether terrorism is more in the "left" or more in the "right", but you're being incredibly vague, both of you. And this kind of "discussion" is nothing but divisive, pointlessly so. Arguments should be about actual positions and policy, not identities.

The main reason I dislike "left" vs "right" politics is I see it all the time where possibly valid arguments are just completely disregarded because it's "left-wing" or "right-wing", because the person doing this identifies as the opposite.
I'm not saying it's more left or right wing, that's mechamind's weird agenda here associating terrorism with the right. All I've said is that it exists, and is just as prevalent on the left as the right.

I'd like to discuss policy, but that's hard to do just considering what forum this topic is on and how serious stuff is handled. People tend to not read (especially not sources), and just reply so it's kind of pointless discussing such things.
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election

Postby Paper » Thu Jul 14, 2016 12:08 pm

if jill stein is up there why cant i also vote for R L Stein and Vermin Supreme
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election

Postby Aero » Thu Jul 14, 2016 12:19 pm

PaperPlayerX wrote:if jill stein is up there why cant i also vote for R L Stein and Vermin Supreme
spooky election with funny hats? count me in.

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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election

Postby mechamind » Thu Jul 14, 2016 2:14 pm

I think there's plenty of horror in this election already, but it's worth a try. He might just get booted off, though.
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election

Postby Aero » Thu Jul 14, 2016 4:41 pm

As long as one man goes hungry nobody should eat until everyone is full.

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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election

Postby Kyo Saito » Thu Jul 14, 2016 4:55 pm


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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election

Postby Paper » Thu Jul 14, 2016 5:45 pm

PaperPlayerX wrote:Vermin Supreme
mechamind wrote:He might just get booted off, though.
IS THAT SUPPOSED TO BE A FUCKING PUN
BECAUSE IF IT IS

...

then that'd actually be kinda funny lmao
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election

Postby Aero » Sun Jul 17, 2016 5:56 pm

One of the cops killed in Baton Rouge today:

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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election & General Politics/Events

Postby Aero » Tue Jul 19, 2016 12:26 pm

RNC 7/18/19 - Yuge Speeches

Melania Speech
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_MVHzHyVQk

Rudy Giuliani
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aB3vyvKZszI

Benghazi Annex Security Team
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOlgAK5iAtI

Patricia Smith, mother of Benghazi victim
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TN1RvEmMPLk

Sheriff Clarke
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1HicNh2W7I

Gov. Rick Perry & Marcus Luttrell
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYrglFmNEL0

Gen. Michael Flynn
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bA-Z2vmaFU

Powerful stuff! Trump's road to the White House is now paved in gold and silver.
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election & General Politics/Events

Postby Valtteri » Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:34 pm

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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election & General Politics/Events

Postby Aero » Tue Jul 19, 2016 7:12 pm

I've seen this before and it's a 30 minute video so I can't (and really shouldn't) go through each of Harris' points, but I will direct you to other sources that explain and analyze what Harris calls his "gut feeling" about him and what Trump hides behind his persona:

Scott Adams' Blog: http://blog.dilbert.com/ - Goes into detail about how persuasive Trump really is without people being aware of it, and why he does and says the things he does. For example, why he aggravates his opponents to where they're obsessed with him (see: Jeb Bush, Marco Rubio, Elizabeth Warren) and how that is a calculated effort to appear on top of those opponents. He's been on Bill Maher, and FOX explaining this and makes a better - and reasonable I should say - case than Harris for having reservations about a Trump presidency.

Art of the Deal: http://bit.ly/29TyLkg - Not a How To book for making deals, but an explanation of Trump's past deals giving insight into what works and what doesn't work. Making a "radical" claim like banning all Muslims from entering the U.S. as a starting point then working down from there to a moderate approach follows his deal making strategy. It gets everyone that wants the complete shutdown, and snatches up everyone in favor of the more moderate policies that are revealed as time moves along. Starting at a modest proposal doesn't separate you from the crowd, and is easier to demolish every time it is proposed. He also talks about handling the media, and showed that he can get $1 billion of free advertising out of them with simple strategies like his truthful hyperbole.

You also have to look at who Trump is talking to, and not just what he says. Nuance gets lost in a crowd, and the audience is at home and not in the studio interview. He speaks far more plainly and uses one syllable words in front of crowds of 10,000 people so it's easier to follow along and gin up support and have campaign quotes like "Make America Great Again." "Build the wall!," "The wall just got ten feet higher," "Get 'em out of here," "HUGE," and of course the classic "You're fired!" There's a whole bunch of psychology behind what Trump says that applies to marketing, and you have to look at him as the brander he is to truly understand it all. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Readability
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election & General Politics/Events

Postby Valtteri » Tue Jul 19, 2016 7:35 pm

So you're saying he appeals to stupid people. Idk I think you're completely overlooking his very apparent ignorance of the world and of course the racism, misogyny and bigotry. He's done dozens of things like making fun of the disabled reporter that would have ended anyone else's campaign, and his poll numbers just go up. He's so bad that people put infinitely lower expectations on him than the rest of the candidates and it's frightening.
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election & General Politics/Events

Postby Aero » Tue Jul 19, 2016 7:47 pm

That's the exact conventional wisdom causing the Democrats to lose this election.
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election & General Politics/Events

Postby Valtteri » Tue Jul 19, 2016 7:56 pm

Conventional anti intellectualism shall rise again
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election & General Politics/Events

Postby Aero » Tue Jul 19, 2016 8:02 pm

"Everyone but me is dumb."
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election & General Politics/Events

Postby TLtimelord » Tue Jul 19, 2016 9:44 pm

I say that most of the damage any democrat fears Trump will do has already been done. He has allowed people to speak whatever the hell they want, no matter how awful, racist, and biggoted it is. Under him, the first amendment in so many ways is straight-up abused and manipulated.

As for Clinton, it would be best if she actually addressed her damn email issue instead of trying to constantly brush it off, because it's just causing people to focus more on it.

So for the election? It's someone who has done stupid/horrible shit versus someone who will do stupid/horrible shit. I think I know who I'm voting for in November.
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Re: [POLL] 2016 American Election & General Politics/Events

Postby Aero » Tue Jul 19, 2016 10:24 pm

If Trump didn't come along would these nameless people not be awful, racist, or bigoted? Pushing aside how empty these accusations are, they're not dependent on who is running for office but instead it comes from them and they project it onto Trump. The First Amendment isn't something that can be abused either. You can say whatever you want, and by design, the First Amendment protects it. To the previous point, it's supposed to allow these awful, racist, and/or bigoted statements to be aired out and available to proper scrutiny unlike in much of Europe where it is illegal hate speech that festers in the dark, and grows from there out into the mainstream. It hasn't stopped the rise of radical authoritarian movements there, and if you ask me I think it just facilitated their movement.

Personally, I don't have a problem with awful, racist, or even bigoted messages either. If something is awful, you have the option to turn away from it, or help the situation in some way. If something is racist (which basically means any non-egalitarian views on race now), have the intellectual honesty to bring up the facts if and when they contradict what the person is saying. If something is bigoted, same thing. This is what the First Amendment is for. Some of the things I myself believe would be considered awful, racist (by contemporary standards, not by the actual definition), and bigoted yet I'm able to give citations when asked, and it comes down to whether or not wrong think should be punished; I don't think so, and it's imperative for a free society for that not to be so.
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