You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

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You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby DarkMatt » Fri May 12, 2017 11:52 am

>Having troubles with 1.4? Lol get 2.0.
>Can't make something work? You can make it work with 2.0.
>It'd be easier if you had 2.0
>2.0 is more powerful.

It's time to stop posts like the above, because who are you to dictate who should make what in what? Selling 2.0 to users is fine and good, but I'm starting to notice that people are aggressively trying to force people to use 2.0 instead of helping them with what they're using. If you don't know anything about a version of SMBX that's not superior to your eyes, can you please stop trying to convert people to the one true SMBX version? It's not nice, nor is it productive, to force people to adapt when they're content with some other version of SMBX. If you really want people to use 2.0, then tough, you're just gonna have to trust 2.0 to be clearly superior to all other versions and for people to start using it of their own volition. But that's beside the point, what does it matter to you if they're using 1.4 or 1.3?

Seriously, what does it matter? Most people who mess around in SMBX do so for their own entertainment, not yours, nor mine's. If they ask for help it's nice to give it. If they ask for design advice then it's nice to offer critique. If they want neither then you should give neither. Newbies using SMBX should not have to conform to one standard just because neckbeards perched high in the SMBX community think it should be the one standard. Those newbies want to have fun and share fun. I mean, it's a shame they'll probably hit the brick wall that is >trying to appeal to a broad audience, but that's a learning experience, not something to be avoided; and if they wake up and decide to seriously pursue level design then we already give all the help they could possibly ask for. If they don't and just continue making stuff that entertains themselves then, I'm sorry you're troubled by how simple one's entertainment can be, but there's nothing you can do about it.

So if someone's content to use the old versions until they learn what they're missing out on, then just shrug and leave them be. So they don't play your 2.0 episode, or learn how to use PGE, or stick with a years old program. Who cares? This isn't a war, people should choose whatever they think will satisfy their desire to make Mario levels, even if they would "miss out".
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby FireyPaperMario » Fri May 12, 2017 11:56 am

Nice promotional topic man! :P ^^
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby Enjl » Fri May 12, 2017 11:59 am

brb using 1.2.2 from now on
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby Catskart » Fri May 12, 2017 12:02 pm

Completly agree with you, sadly some people won't understand that and continue forever...

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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby DJFMHD » Fri May 12, 2017 12:03 pm

I get it there are users that use every chance they get to talk about 2.0. (I have a specific one in my head at the moment) I gets tedious what if i cant use smbx 2.0 for some reason.
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby Mable » Fri May 12, 2017 12:06 pm

DJFMHD wrote:I get it there are users that use every chance they get to talk about 2.0. (I have a specific one in my head at the moment) I gets tedious what if i cant use smbx 2.0 for some reason.
Explain those reasons? People are willing to help you if you tell them exactly what the problem is.
Catskart wrote:Completly agree with you, sadly some people won't understand that and continue forever...
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby Thehelmetguy1 » Fri May 12, 2017 12:09 pm

FINALLY SOMEONE THAT IS ACTUALLY RATIONAL HERE!
Now seriously, I couldn't agree more with this post. Instead of actually helping a user, people think that saying "use 2.0" is enough, and that it is helping. Last time I checked this isn't helping other users. The only thing you all are doing here is DISCOURAGING people from using 2.0 and giving the person a bad view towards the community. And you know pretty well who you are. Pretty sad this thread won't affect who it is supposed to affect.
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby Electriking » Fri May 12, 2017 12:09 pm

I see nothing wrong with recommending SMBX 2.0 (or any other version). Sometimes 2.0 is the only solution to certain problems because that is the version that fixes said problems. If 2.0 is the only version that can fix someone's problem with SMBX, then you are basically saying "don't help this person because you are going to have to tell them to get 2.0". I think that is worse than trying to help someone by saying they should get 2.0.
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby DJFMHD » Fri May 12, 2017 12:10 pm

Mable wrote:
DJFMHD wrote:I get it there are users that use every chance they get to talk about 2.0. (I have a specific one in my head at the moment) I gets tedious what if i cant use smbx 2.0 for some reason.
Explain those reasons? People are willing to help you if you tell them exactly what the problem is.
Catskart wrote:Completly agree with you, sadly some people won't understand that and continue forever...
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I don't get your question, rephrase and maybe i can give you a answer
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby HeroLinik » Fri May 12, 2017 12:11 pm

DJFMHD wrote:I don't get your question, rephrase and maybe i can give you a answer
It's actually a really simple question. It's just "explain the reasons why I can't use smbx 2.0" and that's it.
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby underFlo » Fri May 12, 2017 12:13 pm

if someone has problem with another version there is obviously a problem so I'm not sure if "the user's content with it" applies 100%.

Also, I think "2.0 fixes the mushroom-in-lava bug" or"2.0 is more flexible" are essentially true statements (the latter being somewhat more debatable), and as such I don't see the issue with pointing them out and leaving the choice to the user.
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby Thehelmetguy1 » Fri May 12, 2017 12:15 pm

If the person is using 1.4 is is obviously because they prefer it over 2.0
King of Eterity wrote:I see nothing wrong with recommending SMBX 2.0 (or any other version). Sometimes 2.0 is the only solution to certain problems because that is the version that fixes said problems. If 2.0 is the only version that can fix someone's problem with SMBX, then you are basically saying "don't help this person because you are going to have to tell them to get 2.0". I think that is worse than trying to help someone by saying they should get 2.0.
Funny how you are one of the guys that say "get 2.0" the most in help and support forum
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby Enjl » Fri May 12, 2017 12:17 pm

HeroLinik wrote:
DJFMHD wrote:I don't get your question, rephrase and maybe i can give you a answer
It's actually a really simple question. It's just "explain the reasons why I can't use smbx 2.0" and that's it.
decade-old pc that can't use a proper opengl version is the most common reason.

There are zero downsides to switching to SMBX2, as it provides bugfixes and maintains full compatibility with any creation made in 1.3 or older versions. The problem comes when people who have no idea of the issue someone's facing use it as an excuse for a post they pull out of their sleeve and think they're helping someone.
While I don't think it discourages use of the recommended version, it is an useless and unhelpful post.
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby Cedur » Fri May 12, 2017 12:19 pm

Darkmatt you surely have a point, but I think you make too many insinuations. I don't know everything that people talk so prove me wrong, but iirc it's usually like

> person A uses 1.3 or 1.4 and meets a bug / the engine is deficient and doesn't allow for a certain feature
> person A asks around what to do
> people have a simple answer: use 2.0 / PGE because 2.0 can do this and it's no big trouble downloading

It's not usually aggressive, I've rather seen obstinacy from person A not being pleased with the answer and straight out refusing to upgrade to the engine that is indeed superior in many ways, officially supported, and planned to be the standard version for the future. From what I've seen other people don't try to "convert", they just try to guide person A to the easiest and most common thing. And if you're not familiar with 1.4, you can't give a different answer than "use 2.0" anyway, but still, it's a decent answer. And this is some lovely response from person A:
Catskart wrote:Your behavior is worst and worst, some 2.0 users, I try to solve his problem instead to say "2.0" directly, seriously, I know you want that no one use 38A version but it isn't the case.
A flat insult to an innocent user giving a genuine suggestion on how to efficiently solve a problem. I'm with KoE here.

So, I'd like to see concrete examples on "other people" being aggressive or bad-intentioned.
Last edited by Cedur on Fri May 12, 2017 12:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby underFlo » Fri May 12, 2017 12:22 pm

thehelmetguy1 wrote:If the person is using 1.4 is is obviously because they prefer it over 2.0
You're assuming users start out 100% informed. The first version you come across for whichever reason is usually the one you stick with. Actually preferring something requires knowledge about both things. If somebody doesn't know of X2's existance that doesn't really apply.

That being said, if someone is obviously aware of each egnine's differences and chooses one of them, that's 100% ok. I think Catskart was the one who made a boss that's impressive from a technical standpoint in 38A so I'm not gonna go to him and tell him to switch to X2 (even tho he did take criticism with the design as 38A hate, lol)
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby HeroLinik » Fri May 12, 2017 12:23 pm

thehelmetguy1 wrote:FINALLY SOMEONE THAT IS ACTUALLY RATIONAL HERE!
Now seriously, I couldn't agree more with this post. Instead of actually helping a user, people think that saying "use 2.0" is enough, and that it is helping. Last time I checked this isn't helping other users. The only thing you all are doing here is DISCOURAGING people from using 2.0 and giving the person a bad view towards the community. And you know pretty well who you are. Pretty sad this thread won't affect who it is supposed to affect.
Indeed. Usually people that say "use 2.0" or anything similar to that don't even know how to answer the OP's question about their problem with 1.4/1.3.0.1/whatever and are only saying it just so they look "helpful". I can draw parallels between that and certain situations that I've encountered in programming; imagine if someone enrolled onto a programming course and this happened:

New programmer: Hi, I'm learning some basic HTML/CSS and PHP using TextMate on my Mac.
Experienced programmer: Psst, why? PHP is awful and TextMate sucks. You should learn Node.js, and code in Vim.
New programmer: Um...OK...

Like with the 2.0 situation above, it's completely demoralising to the OP, suggesting that their choice of programming language and IDE is "bad" and they should use something else instead. In this case, it would be unlikely that they'd want to continue programming if they were to be subjected to hostility like this. It's like throwing away a lot of hard work that took you ages to attain because you're forcing them to relearn the entire program. What if, in the very unlikely case, that it isn't possible to download 2.0? If you can't think of anything good to say other than something along the lines of "use 2.0" then don't even answer, or at least make an effort to answer based on what they're using.
Last edited by HeroLinik on Fri May 12, 2017 12:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby Electriking » Fri May 12, 2017 12:26 pm

And so what if someone who uses 1.3 and 1.4 comes along and asks about something that can only be done in 2.0? Should we like, not help them at all?
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby Thehelmetguy1 » Fri May 12, 2017 12:27 pm

Sorry if I am going overboard, but in all sincerety, I think that if the person says that he has a problem with SMBX 38A, the person should talk about 38A when trying to help. This is because 2.0 and 1.4 have a lot of differences, and the person might prefer 1.4. So please stop, because it doesn't really help or add anything to the discussion. You can advertise 2.0, but at least give an idea of how the problem can be solved in the version the person is using.
Last edited by Thehelmetguy1 on Fri May 12, 2017 12:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby HeroLinik » Fri May 12, 2017 12:29 pm

King of Eterity wrote:And so what if someone who uses 1.3 and 1.4 comes along and asks about something that can only be done in 2.0? Should we like, not help them at all?
Then in this case, then it's fine to mention 2.0, as long as a constructive worked-through solution is given using it. It may still be advertising 2.0, but it's not simply telling them to get it and then just leaving them for dust. Nobody goes into a new editor expected to know every single little in and out of it.
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Re: You should get [SMBX VERSION NUMBER HERE].

Postby underFlo » Fri May 12, 2017 12:29 pm

HeroLinik wrote:
thehelmetguy1 wrote:FINALLY SOMEONE THAT IS ACTUALLY RATIONAL HERE!
Now seriously, I couldn't agree more with this post. Instead of actually helping a user, people think that saying "use 2.0" is enough, and that it is helping. Last time I checked this isn't helping other users. The only thing you all are doing here is DISCOURAGING people from using 2.0 and giving the person a bad view towards the community. And you know pretty well who you are. Pretty sad this thread won't affect who it is supposed to affect.
Indeed. Usually people that say "use 2.0" or anything similar to that don't even know how to answer the OP's question about their problem with 1.4/1.3.0.1/whatever and are only saying it just so they look "helpful". I can draw parallels between that and certain situations that I've encountered in programming; imagine if someone enrolled onto a programming course and this happened:

New programmer: Hi, I'm learning some basic HTML/CSS and PHP using TextMate on my Mac.
Experienced programmer: Psst, why? PHP is awful and TextMate sucks. You should learn Node.js, and code in Vim.
New programmer: Um...OK...

Like with the 2.0 situation above, it's completely demoralising to the OP, suggesting that their programming is "bad" and they should use something else instead. It's like throwing away a lot of hard work that took you ages to attain because you're forcing them to relearn the entire program. What if, in the very unlikely case, that it isn't possible to download 2.0? If you can't think of anything good to say other than something along the lines of "use 2.0" then don't even answer, or at least make an effort to answer based on what they're using.
I'd argue that your example is detrimental to your point because in your case the new programmer has no experience in PHP - imagine if they wanted to learn Basic or some other archaic language (which can be useful as training maybe, but not used at all for practical purposes today). The experienced programmer only wants to help the newer one and stop them from limiting themselves.

Also the case of being unable to use X2 is super unlikely so I don't see the issue in mentioning it (unless he said so before).

Like y'all are really overdramaticizing it and creating a war between X2 and 38A when there really is one (the only 38A I'd want to go to war against is 38A as a person because his work ethic is frankly awful and detrimental to his own engine).
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